Talk:Spark Shuriken
Damage Calculation
Now, I'm normally pretty good with maths, but I'm having difficulty finding a damage formula that fits this. I tested the attack against Grand Chimeras in Otka IslandI've tried EPA, both with a set increase and a multiplier, and a straight Power-based attack. My closest has been an EPA with a multiplier of around 0.75 for three of my characters, but following that vein, the sums give my Sveta a multiplier of 0.62. I've doubled checked all my work, and I get the same numbers. For those who want to triple check, my Matthew has an attack of 780 and a Jupiter Power of 77, Tyrell has 669 attack and 78 Jupiter Power, Sveta has 663 attack and 149 Jupiter Power, and Amiti has 616 attack and 76 Jupiter Power. For a Power offensive, Matthew gets ~204, Tyrell ~158, Sveta ~110, and Amiti ~138. For an EPA with a set increase, the set increase I get for Matthew is ~-62, Tyrell ~-50, Sveta ~-74, and Amiti ~-43. I've already said what I got for a multiplier based EPA. Help anyone? Phimi (talk) 14:54, 15 October 2012 (CDT)
Forgot to mention, Matthew did 181 damage, Tyrell 141 damage, Sveta 137, Amiti 122. Phimi (talk) 14:59, 15 October 2012 (CDT)
- That's certainly strange - items tend to ignore an adept's elemental power and stats. Your results seem to imply that it doesn't... double checking - this was all on the exact same type of monster, right? Rolina (talk) 21:07, 15 October 2012 (CDT)
- Yes, all against a Grand Chimera. Since it says both in the game's text and here that it deals Jupiter damage, I considered it essential to include the elemental modifier term. I've just checked my own calculations as just ordinary non-elemental attacks, and it's as you said, ignoring anything to do with elemental power, instead just an ordinary attack multiplied by 0.7 with a chance to stun, so that should probably get mentioned. Phimi (talk) 14:43, 16 October 2012 (CDT)
- Nonono, it's very likely Jupiter elemental. But items never consider caster power - they always use a flat 100 checked against the enemy's resist. Perhaps do a bit more testing with a wider range of enemies to double check this. I recommend using a max-level party for your testing so as to get the most clear result. If this is an item that does damage relative to the user's attack power, that'd make it unique among all the offensive items, as the rest just seem to emulate a psynergy. Rolina (talk) 20:16, 26 December 2012 (CST)
- Yup, definitely non-elemental. Just tested it against 12 monsters, with Jupiter resistance ranging from 7 to 193. With an Elemental Modifier term with the user's power replaced with 100, the multiplier varies from 0.5695001683 to 0.9171775211, whereas without any Elemental Modification at all, it ranges from 0.6980108499 to 0.706231454, close enough to account for the random 1-3 point addition at the end of the calculation. As a straight power based attack, just like the others, the base power varies from 177.6842105263 to 244 (The elemental modifier was 1, hence the lack of decimals for that result). Seems they're unique. I did all this on a spreadsheet, so if you want to take a look at it all, just say. Phimi (talk) 17:01, 27 December 2012 (CST)
- Huh, wow. That's a pretty interesting find. Good job with the work. Just one last question... why the hell would we have an item that does less than normal attack damage, no elemental exploitation possible, and is easily outclassed by like, everything? I wonder what they were thinking... Even the normal Shuriken attack is better than this. Rolina (talk) 19:40, 27 December 2012 (CST)
- Yup, definitely non-elemental. Just tested it against 12 monsters, with Jupiter resistance ranging from 7 to 193. With an Elemental Modifier term with the user's power replaced with 100, the multiplier varies from 0.5695001683 to 0.9171775211, whereas without any Elemental Modification at all, it ranges from 0.6980108499 to 0.706231454, close enough to account for the random 1-3 point addition at the end of the calculation. As a straight power based attack, just like the others, the base power varies from 177.6842105263 to 244 (The elemental modifier was 1, hence the lack of decimals for that result). Seems they're unique. I did all this on a spreadsheet, so if you want to take a look at it all, just say. Phimi (talk) 17:01, 27 December 2012 (CST)
- Nonono, it's very likely Jupiter elemental. But items never consider caster power - they always use a flat 100 checked against the enemy's resist. Perhaps do a bit more testing with a wider range of enemies to double check this. I recommend using a max-level party for your testing so as to get the most clear result. If this is an item that does damage relative to the user's attack power, that'd make it unique among all the offensive items, as the rest just seem to emulate a psynergy. Rolina (talk) 20:16, 26 December 2012 (CST)
- Yes, all against a Grand Chimera. Since it says both in the game's text and here that it deals Jupiter damage, I considered it essential to include the elemental modifier term. I've just checked my own calculations as just ordinary non-elemental attacks, and it's as you said, ignoring anything to do with elemental power, instead just an ordinary attack multiplied by 0.7 with a chance to stun, so that should probably get mentioned. Phimi (talk) 14:43, 16 October 2012 (CDT)
